[LifeStyle] Dining across the divide: ‘I told her she was very cunning – in a nice way’

[BirSaNN]

Feminism, the EU and even sex differences in chimps – can these strangers agree on anything?

Zoe Williams
Zoe Williams
@zoesqwilliams
Thu 8 Dec 2022 12.30 GMT
Sula, 28, London
Sula
Occupation Government statistician

Voting record Lib Dem in 2015 and 2017, then Green in 2019

Amuse bouche Is training for a sprint triathlon, having taken it up to overcome her fear of swimming

Tabitha, 45, Cambridge
Tabitha
Occupation Piano teacher

Voting record Has voted Green, Lib Dem, Labour, Tory, Women’s Equality Party. Brexit party in the last European elections – isn’t a fan of rightwing parties, but wanted to leave the EU

Amuse bouche Has homeschooled her teenage son since he was five

For starters
Tabitha She was a bit more reserved than I expected. I felt like the junior partner in terms of maturity. She was more poised and less gushy than me.

Sula I was expecting someone stuffy and conservative, a stiff-upper-lip vibe. It wasn’t like that at all. She was really chatty. There wasn’t any small talk, we were straight in.

Tabitha We ate the same thing, which is a bit naff: pumpkin, grilled radicchio and pistachios, which was divine. Then we had the celeriac and three-cheese cannelloni, but by that point I’d stopped thinking about what we were eating as I was focused on the conversation.

The big beef
Sula We disagreed most on feminism. I think she is basically feminist, but she didn’t want to use that label. She doesn’t agree with extreme branches of feminism, but I don’t agree with extreme branches either. She said, “If I lived in Iran, I’d be a feminist.” She thinks – which is insane – that the current strand of feminism is about hating men, and men have had to give up so much more: they’re constantly being told their male traits are negative. They’re having to do more of the work to get along with women. She thinks all the men she knows are afraid to be men.

Tabitha She was really unimpressed by my claim not to be a feminist. But I feel the term is carrying around a lot of baggage. I don’t want my son to carry the weight of other men’s failings on his small shoulders. I obviously believe in equality, but in every possible context, women can be openly praised for their typically female qualities – you can say, “We need more women in this, they’d bring x, y and z to the job” – and men can be criticised for their typically male characteristics, but if you did the reverse, you’d get fired.

link: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/dec/08/dining-across-the-divide-i-told-her-she-was-very-cunning-in-a-nice-way